Rear Disc Conversion

[JAMIE B.]

Just thinking out loud here, Alan

Just had a thought, what if you swapped the hubs round (r/h for l/h etc) thus mounting the caliper to the rear of the hub rather than the front, this may provide you with a more direct route for the hand brake cable. Some cars do have the calipers to the rear of the hub (rear calipers only)

Feel free to shoot my idea down, I may be missing something!!

Just my 2p's worth

Incedentially what age of golf did the calipers come from ??

 

[Phaeton]

Looked at doing this, but the steering arms get in the way, I don't think the cables will present a problem as they will sweep under the car to the handbrake lever but time will tell. The Golf is/was a MK2 GTi which was around the 1990 era.

Alan...

 

[Phaeton]

Well been out today to have a play with the brakes, totally given up on the fronts now (see other post) so thought I would try to finish off the rears. I've been & bought a Golf GTi handbrake lever but it won't fit as it's too long & would foul the gear stick, so the only bit I'm using will be the swivel plate that the cables attach to. Now I know what is needed this could easily be made, Kev had already made a plate to go at the rear of the tunnel with two holes through for the cables with notches out, these happen to be perfect sized for the Golf cables. I've then used a piece of 6mm screwed rod to join the handbrake to the cables. Once done & handbrake pulled up 3 notches I had a 18" bar through the wheel studs & I was jumping up & down on it & the disc didn't move, I'm well pleased. No photo's as it was dark by the time I had finished but will try tomorrow.

Alan...

 

[Phaeton]

Views of the handbrake & linkage, had to cut a bit more of the tunnel piece away from the rear bulkhead to give clearance luckily not required under the tank. Cables will need a couple of brackets made to hold them up at the rear of the subframe but I'm going to do the exhaust first & then keep cables away from that.[br]





Alan...

 

[Mini Mad Max]

That is the work of a genious! lol
Max

 

[Mini Mad Max]

Hi, i've been doing some research for my rear conversion. I'm going for mk4 calipers, as they are slightly less prone to cease as they have an internal handbrake mechanism, plus the body is alloy so wont rust so much. They do however need different hoses but they're only £4.60 each.
With your handbrake cables, did you have to crimp on those threaded ends? as the mk4 cable has like a throttle cable end (small metal cylinder shapes) to it where it attaches to the handbrake:

Also, what did you do in terms of hoses? do the VW hoses go into a T shape connecter that you can attach a hose from the MC from.
Thanks,
Max

 

[Phaeton]

Max,

I've just typed out a full explanation of what you need it's very simple, but when I read it back it sounded so complicated. You basically need a flat plate 3x30x75ish a hole in the centre to connect a rod to the actual handbrake, this does not want to be tight, it needs to tilt/swivel slightly to take up differences in the cables. The 2 holes same distance apart as the holes in the subframe as above, with slotted to get the cables to the holes & finally something to stop the cables coming out again.

Does this make sense? I reread this & I'm still not sure I would understand it.

Just found this which may explain it better



But if you don;t have the threaded ends, you need slotted holes to hold your cables.



Alan...

 

[Mini Mad Max]

Ahh thanks alan, i see now. So i take it the threaded ends came on your cables. I don't know if i have to use mk4 cables for mk4 calipers as one thread i saw a guy say that he used mk2 sirocco cables on mk4 calipers so i'm guessing it's interchangeable amongst golfs. What mk was your cables from, mk2 i imagine.
Thanks very much  !
Max

 

[mud68]

Alan, I have just fitted this conversion to my buggy .... the braided hose you suggested making it longer. Did you fit them from the top of the caliper then bend it (s shape) down towards the tie rod, then fit it under the subframe to the original mounting point?
Do you think 390mm is still the right length?
Last question - who made the hoses for you?
Thanks Shaun

 

[Phaeton]

Shaun, that sounds about right, but if it's still light when I get home I'll take a picture. The length I had was a little tight but okay. If you already have braided hoses all I would if doing it again is just make up some imperial to metric convertor.

Alan

 

[mud68]

Alan, I also thought about going from the caliper and looping it around the back of the damper (in between the subframe) and then attaching it near the top of the original mounting postion. This way you haven't got to up from the caliper then down & under the bottom of the subframe. If your way works i might just stick to that.
Shaun

 

[Phaeton]

Shaun,

By the time I got back tonight it was too dark, that & the batteries in the camera were flat. Tried to take a picture with the phone but it didn't come out well. But I have found these, not sure if they have been posted before.

They are about all the ones I have, if you need anymore, I'll get you some when I get home tomorrow, camera batteries on charge.

But as I said what I would do is use the existing Mini flexible pipes to come from the subframe & down to near the calliper, then I would make up or have made up some short adaptor pipes out of copper. Male 10mm fittings at one end for the Golf calliper & Female 3/8" (I think, CHECK) at the other, then using a bit of flattened 15mm copper pipe make a bracket which can be soldered to the brake pipe & bolted to the calliper, if that make sense. I think Simon (Esdebe) did something similar on his alternative setup, he may have a picture.

My callipers are mounted upside down, bit of a pig to bleed but good once done.

Alan...

 

[mud68]

It makes sense now, my calipers are on the right way up. With your set up the caliper brake hose connection is at the bottom so the hose has less distance to travel to the subframe and only has to do a 'u' shape loop. My way I will need longer hoses (I cut the originals off as well).
Thanks for your help.

PS any body want the original drum set up and driveshafts?

 

[Phaeton]

If you do go for new braided hoses I got mine from Russ at http://www.furorecars.co.uk/ he'll do the Mini ends on if you ask.

Alan...

 

[esdebe]

I did try to make some short adapters but didn't like the way they looked so I went the route of having braided hoses made by the same guy you mentioned in your post.  I had a 90 degree end put on the calliper end of the hose to reduce the S share to a sort or 5 shape without the line on the top of it if that makes sense...

 

[jason_l]

Right,

Me and Max both bought new MK4 Golf calipers at Stoneleigh and will both be doing this conversion shortly so expect lots of questions from both of us, although i think Max knows what he is doing more than me!  ;D

I have the calipers, carriers and the mini disc hubs so im guessing the first job will be getting the hubs machined to accept the calipers in the correct position. Alan, Max mentioned that you have an adaptor plate behind the disc? If i get the hubs machined for the discs to sit correctly i take it i don't need the spacer/adaptor?

Jason

 

[Phaeton]

Jason, Have a look at Jamie's post http://www.muddybuggies.com/Buggies-For ... 924.0.html he had the tabs machined down an extra 2mm which means the spacers aren't needed. I 'think' the tab needs to be 10mm think (please check) you can then either decide to do Jamie's other mod of moving the carrier inwards 6mm or not.

Alan...

 

[jason_l]

Hi Alan, thanks for the reply.

After posting up i looked through Jamie's post and thought he probably had them machined down so not to use the spacer as you have. So if i don't have them machined down i will need a 2mm spacer behind the disc then? Hmmmm. Think it will come down to if the machine shop can remove the 2mm of material then i will go that route. If not i will add the spacer, not fussed either way.

I may have to do Jamies version of making the caliper sit further in on the disc as i have 13's and may foul on the wheels if they are not further in!

Did you supply a jig to the machine shop like Jamie did Alan or just hand them over and say what you wanted?

Jason

Jason, Have a look at Jamie's post http://www.muddybuggies.com/Buggies-For ... 924.0.html he had the tabs machined down an extra 2mm which means the spacers aren't needed. I 'think' the tab needs to be 10mm think (please check) you can then either decide to do Jamie's other mod of moving the carrier inwards 6mm or not.

Alan...

 

[Phaeton]

They need to be machined down either way as you're taking metal off the sloping side of the hub as it exists at the moment, the Golf calipers bolt to the other side of the lugs. As mine was experimental I had the machine shop just machine enough off until they were flat, then found clearance problems, hence the 2mm spacer to push the drive flange 2mm outwards. Jamie had the advantage of knowing this & got the machine shop to take the extra 2mm off the lugs which is a far better idea. I just supplied my machine shop with the hubs as was, no idea how they held them for machining.

As for running 13" rims I have no issues with them, there's plenty of clearance, I've even had 12" steel rims on there.

Alan...

 

[jason_l]

They need to be machined down either way as you're taking metal off the sloping side of the hub as it exists at the moment, the Golf calipers bolt to the other side of the lugs. As mine was experimental I had the machine shop just machine enough off until they were flat, then found clearance problems, hence the 2mm spacer to push the drive flange 2mm outwards. Jamie had the advantage of knowing this & got the machine shop to take the extra 2mm off the lugs which is a far better idea. I just supplied my machine shop with the hubs as was, no idea how they held them for machining.

As for running 13" rims I have no issues with them, there's plenty of clearance, I've even had 12" steel rims on there.

Alan...

Thanks Alan. Thats exactly what i needed to know! Now i have to find a local machine shop that can do the work once i have shot blasted the hubs clean.

Thought they would be ok with 13's. The Rally Design calipers i bought say that they are only suitable for 14' wheels and up, but obviously with the small hubs on the mini than it shouldn't be a problem. I may supply the machine shop with the discs also so they can see where the caliper needs to fit.

I have so much to do now, should be busy for months with all the bits i have. Even with the buggy in pieces.

If i get a chance i will do a complete walkthrough on the Caliper conversion so it makes it super clear what is required, even though i think there probably is enough info on here Well done Alan, your a legend!!!!!

Jason