SVA Nottingham today

Phaeton

Moderator
Staff member
Well the bottom line was we failed but the upside was not on anything too dramatic.

Alan (hmalan) turned up around 10:45 with his steering wheel & collapsible boss, this was put on only to find the SVA pad sent by Simon (esdebe) wouldn't fit, bizarrely it fitted my steering wheel which wouldn't fit on the boss. So we cut a piece of rubber matting, pushed some bubble wrap down the back & tie wrapped it on (more on this later). We had a coffee, a chat & then loaded Mary onto the dolly to set off for SVA, it was bitter up here today so there was no way I was driving down. After a stop to fill up the tank we arrived in good time 13:15, I went to let them know we were here & was told to park in front of the SVA lane. Started Mary up & got her off the dolly & drove over to the lane, thought I would leave her idling to warm up for the emission test. About 5 minutes later she died, tried to start her again to no joy, if this wasn't a family forum I would type a few of the words that were going through my head.

Just as this happened Martin the tester came out of the shed, i explained what had happened & he didn't seem too concerned & said we could do the other tests. So we pushed her inside & the inspection started. The first thing he wanted to test was the brake failure light, I showed him the rocker switch from the donor that I had put in & pressing it the light came on, he removed the top off the reservoir & the light came on again. Unfortunately the symbol on the brake switch is a brake pedal & a foot which is not acceptable it needs to be the recognisable one of (O) so we had failed within the first 5 minutes. We found out later that Andy actually phoned Swansea to get confirmation on this.

He then started looking around the front & what was contactable surfaces, at this point it seems the double front bumper was causing some concern as to what to apply the floor line to. He went off & brought Andy back & a discussion ensued, the upshot was extra trim was required on the upright stanchions of the mudguard arms, the plate round the bottom where the headlights mount & the chassis near where the top arm is mounted. There was talk that trim was required round the tube where the shock absorber mounted & the clip for the headlight, but once the nose cone was put back on then these area disappeared.

Under the cone, although the wiring was tie-wrapped up, they felt some chaffing could occur & it needed further protection.

Wing mirrors needed 2.5mm radius's on inside edge.

In the passenger compartment, the steering rack needed some protection as it was feasible to trap a passengers foot between the body & the rack on right lock. Brake pipes running along the nearside floor needs some protection from people entering or leaving the vehicle. This next one is interesting, I have 3 switches in a pod, lights, fog, & brake from the donor Mini, the pod is located within the 127mm exemption zone around the steering wheel, but this is only for the driver, they still count as contactable surfaces for the passenger & as such need 2.5mm radius. The pod needs trim on the back edge to give it the 2.5mm. The steering wheel was next, the rubber mat was pulled aside & bubble wrap removed, after talking there are two options, either a fixed boss with a pad fitted (this could be bubble wrap under mat but not tie rapped) or a collapsible boss, with a normal centre. The markings on the brake reservoir to master cylinder pipe was not marked as suitable & no specification sheet was available

At the rear of the Mary, the shock brackets needed trim on upper edge, my lovely engine cover is made of 5/8" box which means the edges don't have 2.5mm radius, if I had made it out of 1" box it would have been fine. Rear light mounting brackets not 2.5mm, it was also pointed out that there was no locking tabs on the top of the hub to track control arm at the rear. There was also some unclipped wiring around the engine compartment.

We then moved on to the ramp, where the handbrake to shock/hub brackets were flexing along with the subframe for the front mountings. I had used standard nuts not nylocks on the tie bars & ball joints. Fuel hose was not marked as suitable for petrol & no specification sheet was available.

We then rolled forward to check the headlight aim, they weren't too far out & with a little brute force by Martin they came in line. Onwards to the brake test which was quite uneventful with clear passes all the way through. As we were passing down the lane we had been trying to get Mary started, we were unable to get out of the lane as somebody had blocked the exit, so as Martin went to see who's car it was I whipped the distributor cap off & turned the engine over whilst Alan confirmed the points weren't opening. We pushed Mary outside to the area for checking mirrors & lights from correct angles, whilst this was being carried out I went & got a screwdriver & then adjusted the points. Way-hey she started, Martin jumped in & took her to be weighed & checking self centring whilst on the way, amazingly she passed. There was a discrepancy on the weights, I had put down the weights from a post a little while ago, front 210kg's rear 330kg's & gross 540kg's she weighed front 235kg's rear 405kg's with only one passenger & he looked 12 stone wet through. His suggestion is when I bring her back we revise these to 270, 450 & 720Kg's respectively. The speedometer couldn't be tested as it is driven off the front wheel & they have no way to test it other than drive it around the yard & then say 'seems okay it's a pass'. Db test was next, came out at 92 & that was the end, we loaded her back on the dolly whilst Martin wrote out war & peace.

It was around 6 hours from setting off to getting back home, I can't say it was the best time of my life but it certainly wasn't as harrowing as it could have been. All in all it was a result, there was nothing major wrong with my build other than a few nuts and quite a few pieces of trim the biggest problem is the flexing on both ends of the handbrake & getting the specification of the pipes for brake & fuel.

Sorry it's such a long post but I thought it best to try to put all the details in for those who have to follow. What I will try to do it take pictures of all the bits that need doing in a before & after status.

My last comment is for Alan, just a note of thanks for the moral support & the offer of half a chicken sandwich today would have been a far worse experience if I would have had to do it on my own.

Alan...
 

Phaeton

Moderator
Staff member
Bad form to reply to ones own posts but I forgot to tell you about the most stomach churning part of the test. Martin had just gone over the back of the car & was ready to move onto the ramps. Andy asked him if he was happy with everything else, he said 'yes' Andy said 'Are you sure?' pointing at the inside of the rear brakes, Martin looked at where he was pointing & said 'manual adjusting brakes, you can't have them'. Again if it wasn't a family forum I would type what was going through my mind, I asked how long that had been the case, 'always' was the answer. Discussion then ensued as to how other people had got their cars SVA'd with the same setup. I stated that I knew the fronts couldn't be manual but thought rears could be. That if that was the case then it would come back with discs on the rear, Alan was totally perplexed as he'd bought new backplates, pistons, shoes, & Minifin druns. They then consulted the bppk of words & luckily we were right they could be manual on the rear, I licked a 240V socket outlet to get heart started again.
 

esdebe

New member
Sorry to hear that is failed, but doesn't look too bad.

Supprided by the number of contactable surfaces at the front.

Supprided by the brake symbol, the book just says it has to be a recognisable symbol, and one of a pedal makes it recognisable, and was enougth for my SVA man, but then he used to work a lot with minis.... So I guess it depends on what the SVA man did in his former life...

So what are you going to do to resolve your stearing wheel problem? Can you fabricate a disk with two sets of holes that can be bolted to the one and then the wheel bolted to it so that it addapts the boss to the stearing wheel?

Simon
 

iank

New member
I think that probably goes down as a good, if stressful, fail.

Nothing too major, think the brake symbol would have gone through if there was nothing else.

So some trim and a couple of pipes with markings+spec sheets is most of it.

What are you doing to cover the steering rack? I guess the old style pedal box covered it before.

On the plus side you should be at Stoneleigh with an SVA'd buggy :D
 

Phaeton

Moderator
Staff member
Well the steering wheel issue can be resolved in 2 ways, either I go back to my existing wheel, without a collaspable boss & Simon's pad, or I use the collaspable boss & buy a new steering wheel. The centre can be a standard horn push type doesn't have to be padded. Think I'm going down the new wheel route, as the boss fits slightly better & doesn't foul my surround.

As to the steering rack, I think I have some chequer plate left, I'm simple going to put an angled pad over the end. This will then continue down the side of the car covering the brake & clutch pipes.

I think it was a bit tough on the symbol, as to be honest it more recognisable as a brake light than (O) but he did check so it's going to have to be changed. Going to look at CBS & see if they have a seperate neon. Nobody knows if a very late mini would have the proper symbol on the switch.

As i said I'll try to take piccies along the way, but do tend to forget.
Alan...
 

iank

New member
"Phaeton"":o6k8vvxu said:

I think it was a bit tough on the symbol, as to be honest it more recognisable as a brake light than (O) but he did check so it's going to have to be changed. Going to look at CBS & see if they have a seperate neon. Nobody knows if a very late mini would have the proper symbol on the switch.

Yes they did, but it's a tad expensive to buy new.
http://www.minispares.com/Product.aspx?pid=33954

Plenty of places do just a warning lamp with the correct symbol. Let me know if can't find a supplier and I'll do some digging.
 

esdebe

New member
At my SVA test my switched were mounted on the passenger side, and I was told they needed more radiusing. As a result I took the power file to them, and then polished them after wards... As a result I rubbed off the original symbol, but I bought a white grout pen and drew them back on :)

You could rub it of and draw one on or see if you can buy a sticker to transfer one with

Simon
 

Danny

Administrator
Hello Alan,

I didnt realise the SVA was today.... well done though.

Have you booked the re test yet?

We will see you at stoneleigh.... If i can afford the insurance...lol

Let us know your progress with the changes

Danny
 

hmalan

New member
As Alan says I went with him and I have to thank him for the opportunity as I am sure you will all agree that actually being able to watch a buggy going through the test before you put your own through is a real benefit.

When you read Alan's post there seemed to be a lot of issues but they are all things that can easily be sorted so as per the previous posts I am sure he will soon be running around in his SVA'd buggy, and as I said they were nearly all trim type issues.

I did consider writing to all the SVA stations to advise them that they should keep defibrillators, as like Alan says my heart stopped when they said it needed auto adjusting brakes on the back.

It is easy for me to say as it wasn't my buggy but I don't think Alan should be particualrly disheartened in any way as there were no questions about the actual build quality of his buggy, though in his shoes I would have been slightly disheartened when they failed his engine cover as its actually very well made, perfect for the job and is even hinged to open and locks closed with a proper mini boot handle, and when you think that you could originaly pass with a cargo net it makes you question some of the standards.

Again the brake test switch issue is a bit dissapointing as again I am sure that at some places it would have passed, and I know that others have passed with exposed brake and clutch pipes running within the passenger compartment they stated that they wanted these boxing in.

But as I said to Alan, thanks for letting me accompany him and I am confident that within a few weeks there will be a post on the site from him telling everyone that his buggy has passed.

Alan
 

esdebe

New member
Alan,

I think if you used the braided flexy pipes for the brakes it wouldn't have been a problem, as they are less easly crushed flat.

As for the rear cover, maybe you could get away with some foam pipe lagging split down the middle and pushed over the edges and cable tied in place, may not loog as good but you can allways remove it after the test ;)


Looks like you have been bussy though, when is your retest?


I had to take my car for an MOT the same day as you, it failed on 4 things, the emissions, I'm having issues with HC level, and 3 of the top ball joints on the wheels were now too loose. Going for retest this morning... I just hope that I have managed to de-tune enought to bring the HC down.
 

hmalan

New member
Simon,

I have the flexi pipes on mine and asked them if these would be ok and they said that they would still want them covering.

The lead examiner also passed a comment during the day that one of the things they did not like to see was pipe lagging, he didn't really say anymore about this and I did not question him as I had already heard this mentioned on another site - I particularly noted this because my brother in law is a plumber and he had already given me miles of the stuff.

Alan T
 

esdebe

New member
True, I recall my SVA man not apreciating pipe lagging and also insulation tape. He could use some more plasic pipe, slice it and put it over the box section like on the tops of the sides.

What is annoying is the way one SVA center differs from the next. Mine had no issues with brake pipes, but was ademant that the wheel had to be colapsable.


Simon
 

esdebe

New member
My HC issue looks like it is due to cold air, after revving the pants of my engine to heat up the exhaust it sailed through... Any one else have emissions issues, is this a side effect of too much cooling from the sucky fan?
 

RichardG

New member
Alan,

thanks for posting all the feedback it will be really helpful for me and others who are still working towards the dreaded SVA.

I have put 2 kit cars thru SVA (Robin Hood and Onyx Firefox) but did not get a first time pass with either as they seem to change the rules a little every time depending on the examiner.

Good luck with the re-test !

Richard
 

hmalan

New member
Simon,

As Alan said when I got to his and we put my collapsible Boss and new style (75mm) Mountney wheel we found that the SVA pad did not fit but would fit Alan's old (100mm) Mountney wheel.

Alan then cut some rubber to fit over the centre and spokes and we left the centre horn push out as he filled this area with padding.

What they said at the test was that they would accept this padding glued on but not tie wrapped.

They also said that you could have the old steering column with the normal boss and a wheel that was padded, which is exactly what my old 1984 mini wheel was, and if I remember correctly from your posts what yours was too, which I understand you failed on.

Or you could have an unpadded wheel, provided it met the requirements for radiused edges with a collapsible Boss
 

Phaeton

Moderator
Staff member
For the engine cover, I've still got some mesh & have bought more edge trim. I'm going to make up panels that fit on the outside of the cover & over the air filter, tie wrap them on & then after the test they may get removed :wink:

What does everybody think about the extra bracing I have put on the top handbrake brackets does it look enough?

Click

Alan...

Oops retest booked for next Thursday, better get busy
 

hmalan

New member
Alan,

Only putting it on and trying will tell for sure, but there didn't appear to be that much flex so hopefully that should do the trick, only question might be once you stop the flex in the subframe how much more pressure that will put on the bracket.

For those who weren't there when the handbrake was being applied the bracket in Alan's photo was flexing and so was his subframe.

Whilst I was previously aware about the brackets flexing it was only when the testers invited me under the car to look that I could see the subframe flexing, as you are normally above the car when testing the handbrake I was not aware of this. Their advice was to put some form of packing between the chassis and subframe.

Alan T
 

funbuggydave

New member
The manual says to put the brackets on the subframe (will remove that in the next version), but it does flex as you say, two ways to fix it.
On my original car it failed that in 1999 so I made two z shaped brackets to brace the subframe to the box section that the floor attaches to, that should stop the flexing.
The other way is to mount the two brackets on the centre channel just behind the seatbelt mounts, it pulls better on the cable then as well.

The area is under redesign at the moment.........

Thanks for the feedback as well, it helps me re-design bits to help future builders, would like to have a chat/beer at Stoneleigh

Sadly bits of the SVA manual seem to be open to interpretation and there do seem to be regional variations, according to the book, the steering column should collapse as prescribed in the manual, I find it strange that some testers have their own additions to the manual.

Well done on the test though, bit of a PITA but nothing major to solve

Dave :D
 
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